How Ayr Wellness Is Resizing for Reality — What Operational Efficiency Really Means ft. George DeNardo

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Bryan Fields: What's up, guys? Welcome back to another episode of The Dime. I'm Bryan Fields. With me as always is Kellen Finney. And this week we've got a very special guest, George DeNardo, president of Ayr Wellness. George, thanks for taking the time — how are you doing today? George DeNardo: I'm doing fantastic. I hope you guys are doing well, and thank you for having me on. Bryan Fields: Excited to dive in. Kellen, how are you doing? Kellen Finney: I'm doing well. Bryan Fields: Excited to get to George today — really excited to dive into everything Ayr's got going on. I'm going to hold down the West Coast today, if you know what I mean. Before we hopped on, George and I do have some allegiances on sports teams that don't need to be named publicly so we don't get shamed, but we are aligned on that — just a little East Coast, West Coast battle. George, if we had to put you on the record, which side are you taking? Love it, love it. So for our listeners unfamiliar with you, can you give a quick background on how you found your way into the cannabis space? George DeNardo: Sure. I mean, a lot of time in what I'll just generically call telecom, oil and gas, fiber optics — various roles, anywhere from procurement to operations to business development. Then in 2018 I transitioned over to cannabis. I was looking for a challenge in my career, and obviously I found the perfect challenge. It's been challenging since 2018, but I'm glad I'm in the industry, and I'm really just trying to develop how we move forward as an industry and as a company. Bryan Fields: I love it. So let's talk about the transition to president of Ayr Wellness, and then just the depth of the challenges that come with taking the top seat, and how it's gone from there. George DeNardo: I mean, challenges — so I joined Ayr from Columbia Care in November of '23. I've been their chief operating officer, and then obviously recently elevated up to president. When I was COO, it was mainly back-of-house — cultivation, manufacturing, doing a lot of work on our brands. Didn't really touch retail. That's really what the president role brought on — the connection between our supply chain functions and our retail. So I work hand in hand daily with our two chief revenue officers, Jamie and Julie Winter — phenomenal team members — really looking at breaking down the barriers between back-of-house and front-of-house people. Bryan Fields: So let's go through that process — you're transitioning to the top seat. Is that a period of time where there can never be a slow period, right? The train is still moving extremely fast, you're trying to grasp all this new information, but at the same time, if you're moving to a different role, someone then has to assume your role. So how does that transition work where both parties can be successful while the train is still moving as fast as possible? George DeNardo: Yeah, well — with my time at Columbia Care, I had both retail and operations, so I was very familiar with the landscape. We had overlapping markets, so I was very familiar with the regulators, the regulatory structure. Really what we did was establish a standardization of a lot of our processes, and worked internally on the development of our team members, because no action should rely on just one person — it's always a team, and establishing that ability to have both upward and downward movement on talent and communication, making sure we're all aligned on the strategy, was extremely important. That's actually allowed me to transition to more of what I'll call a 10,000-foot level instead of ground level with operations. I have phenomenal leaders in place across all of my facilities and the overall general leadership, which allows me to dig in more on what I'll call the revenue-driving facets of the business. So a huge shout-out to my leaders within operations — they've done a phenomenal job of keeping that train going in the right direction that we established in 2024, which allows me to flex a bit more in 2025 on other areas of the business. Bryan Fields: Are there certain areas that when you took over you wanted to dive deeper into from a data standpoint? You talked about aligning the front and back of house — were there areas and opportunities you had immediately envisioned, where you said, this is where we should start because there's opportunity here? George DeNardo: Yes, most definitely. If we look at how Ayr developed — Ayr, like some of the other operators, was strictly built through acquisitions, and there's a lot of integration involved in that. In 2024 we did a lot of integration on our processes. Now what I really want to step into is the integration, and looking at where we're able to gain operational efficiency, either through consolidation of facilities or looking at leases and understanding the four-wall analysis of every state and every operation, to make sure we're making the right decisions to size the business for where it needs to be today. If you look at a lot of the operators starting in 2016–17, it was plant as many flags as you can. Now you're starting to see them peel back and say, okay, we've lost focus as a company. So it's really making sure we're operating with zero expectations from the federal side, and making sure we're creating a healthy business — not only within our state levels, but for our employees and our customers. Bryan Fields: So I imagine your time back in operations has been your secret weapon for this transition. Could you expand on some of the nuances you picked up from the operational side that you're now using to drive the consolidation? Because just because you have a big facility doesn't mean it needs to be running at full capacity — you have to match it to the demand of that market, right? George DeNardo: Yeah — my operational leaders are probably tired of hearing it from me, but really, business isn't that hard. It's ownership, accountability, and servant leadership. All of our leaders — we're here to serve our employees and make sure we're putting them in a position to be successful, with clear ownership and accountability for the different facets of the business. When you have managers that report to managers that report to managers that report to managers, it's almost like the phone game, where you get a diluted message and you're not necessarily making the right decisions. So it's all about streamlining our communication, making it very clear who owns what within the business, what they're accountable for, and making sure we're all swimming in the same direction. It gets segregated very quickly in the cannabis industry, because every state has its own regulatory body, its own regulations, its own state system. Historically we've used that as a crutch, and we shouldn't — yes, regulations change, but that's true of any industry. Go into CPG, food, pharmaceutical — every state has different regulations. It's about making sure you're thinking about it in an efficient and effective manner so you have the right communication to the company. Bryan Fields: I love what you said about the flags, because everybody remembers that map — all right, we're in these eight states, this is where we go — and it was growth at all costs. Now it seems like everyone's peeling back and saying, okay, growth is not the most beneficial number anymore — it's profitability. And getting there involves understanding what your costs are everywhere in the supply chain. When we talk vertical integration, that's understanding the cost from seed in the ground to finished product, extraction, all those details. So were there areas where, looking through the numbers, certain COGS were harder to quantify than others, or vice versa — was there one that was really easy, where you thought, here's an opportunity for us to improve? George DeNardo: Not really — we have phenomenal partners. You have operational leaders, but you also have your shared organizations, and we have great leadership within the finance organization that we're able to work through all the numbers with. It's just making sure we're very familiar with our capital structure and ways we can streamline our operations. On a monthly basis, we look to offset — because let's face it, the cannabis industry was built from nothing, it was very expensive in the beginning. Making sure we're not only operating those facilities efficiently, but also looking at our revenue and profit margins and making sure we're sizing for the industry correctly. You see it in many states — people built these Taj Mahals. If you have 1.5 million square feet of canopy in a state, that's a lot of canopy for the demographics in it. Now, luckily, we have new customers entering the market every day, but that was part of the 2024 build — rebranding, improving our hardware, improving our biomass — because you only have one chance of gaining that new customer, and if they're disappointed, it's very hard to get them back. So making sure we're hitting the mark in 2025. Bryan Fields: Yeah, one would argue it's nearly impossible — if someone has a bad experience they tell five people, and if someone has a good experience they tell two people, something like that. For me, it's more about — do you ever have to go back and audit as things evolve so quickly over time, as the price of product changes? Do you ever have to do an internal audit and say, hey, I know historically our extraction numbers are X, but have we looked into using new tools for X or Y? As new tools and technology come on, you can automate certain features, and that's where we've seen some companies try to make a big cost saving. George DeNardo: Definitely — and that's done on a daily or weekly basis. The cannabis industry — it was very difficult to get quality OEMs or partners outside the industry to assist, so a lot of it was homegrown, patching equipment together. Over the years, technology has evolved — let's look at AI. We're utilizing AI now to look at our sell-through on products, how the brands are capturing, and keeping our budtenders aware of some of the activity going on in the market. So we're constantly leaning into new technology, but it's a daily, weekly, monthly review of: did we hit the operational efficiency we wanted? Did we hit the metrics we were looking for? Do we have to take a look at our crop planning? Do we have to look at different strains for, say, something we wanted to wash, and now we have a strain that could wash better? It's a constant review of the core fundamentals of the business, as well as the high-level P&Ls. Bryan Fields: Do you think the cannabis industry as a whole is up to par with other manufacturing industries in terms of automation and the tools that more established industries are currently utilizing? Do you think the industry is moving its way there? Is it on par? Where would you put the industry as a whole from a technology-automation perspective? George DeNardo: I'd say we're probably still lagging a little, but there have been tremendous improvements over the past two years. Kellen Finney: I think it's because of capital — smart people around this stuff. George DeNardo: You know, bringing in people who actually look at throughput analysis and uptime of equipment — when you attract that kind of talent, you're bringing knowledge from other industries into cannabis. With the consumer base, you're starting to see more people looking to step in from an employment perspective, which is bringing valuable insight from other industries — food, pharmaceutical. We've been able to attract people from pharmaceutical; we have a chef who manages our edibles program. So over the past few years, it's been more promising, as an industry, in terms of how many more people are coming into the cannabis industry to work. Bryan Fields: Do you have a playbook for integrating people from outside the industry into the cannabis industry? Kind of baby steps, so you don't scare them off? George DeNardo: When somebody new to the industry walks into a grow, it sort of takes your breath away. Even with people from within the industry, our PeopleOps team has developed a phenomenal onboarding program where we're shadowing leaders or shadowing people within their function, really making sure we're integrating them into the Ayr way correctly and setting them up for success. We've found that with a lot of other operators, it's here's your trimming scissors, go to it, on day one — no real training. To me, that's just as important as what they accomplish three months down the road. We just hired a new leader within our procurement organization who came from the CPG and retail industry, and we made sure we were very clear on the expectations for zero to three months, three to six months, six months plus, and how we're onboarding her and making sure she's getting all the help she needs to be set up for success. Bryan Fields: So one thing I wanted to reiterate is that the mindset you're bringing in now is a growth mindset — if there are opportunities to do better, we should continue to uncover them, because it's no longer growth at all costs. It's how do we set ourselves up for long-term success? And that starts with dialing in our approach, really understanding our numbers, and automating or improving on every facet we can, because what we've done prior worked to some degree, but now the next phase of the company involves a more meticulous, technology-focused approach. But it's a challenge, because, like Kellen said, it's expensive — so you have a cat-and-mouse game. George, how do you think about that balance of investing in technology that takes two or three months to return on investment, understanding that months four through twelve we could have a nice boom? George DeNardo: Well, again, you have to evaluate everything based on what the needs are. If I have a tool that somebody's pitching me that increases my throughput on, say, flower — but the supply far exceeds the demand — why am I investing in that equipment? So again, it's applying business 101 and really seeing what the business dictates in order for it to be successful, based on geography, or the personnel that we have in place, or packaging. Bryan Fields: How do you guys prioritize those things, though? George DeNardo: Every year we go in with a plan — what's going to define our success. You have your high-level capex. But let's face it, some of these plans are living and breathing, and sometimes we have to pivot very quickly. That's why I'm saying it's always a daily, weekly, and monthly review with the leaders of: did we win the day this past week or month? And how do we win the next 30 or 60 days? That all rolls up into our overall plan — how are we going to be successful over the next one, three, and five years? Bryan Fields: It's a smart approach — level-headed, given the reality of how the industry operates now. You really have to have a daily approach, because there are unknowns every other week. It could have happened this morning and you wouldn't even know — you wake up and think, what's today going to be like, and, oh, there's a fire in the corner, guess my day is no longer going to be like that. One of the elements I want to talk about is the facility consolidation — it seems like your team is going back to its roots. So how does that decision get made? Is it based on how the individual facilities operate, or is it more of a macro strategy — let's go back to what we do best? George DeNardo: First of all, we'll always look at the macro — how the state's performing, what's the trajectory of the state, what do we think strategically, how do we want to look a year from now or three years from now. Then it's looking at each individual facility and saying, okay, what capabilities are there and how are we consolidating this? I'll give you an example: in Nevada, we had a manufacturing center out by Vegas that we closed down in the fourth quarter. All they did was manufacturing, and some of that equipment was very transferable to another facility. We've also recently announced the closure of a grow facility — that was primarily a smaller canopy, so there wasn't a lot of biomass coming out of there, but there was a lot of automation, so we're moving all that automation over and making sure we're doing it the right way for our employees. For our manufacturing center, we identified who we could keep on and made sure we were stable there, and we gave plenty of notice — it wasn't next week we're shutting down, we gave three months' notice so everyone could look for other opportunities, either within the industry or outside it. We're also working with partners on who can take over the facility, retain the employees, and keep things going. So it's making sure we're doing right by the business side of it, but also the people side — making sure we're treating our people fairly and giving them opportunities to be successful, either in other facilities with us, other states, or elsewhere. Bryan Fields: Those relationships are so important — how you handle those, because other companies operating in Nevada or Massachusetts could really benefit from the additional asset coming in. And what I'd imagine is that this is the first of many moves that a lot of these larger companies are going to make as they strip down to their core and figure out what they do best, how they double down on those areas, and how they make sure their numbers are hitting there. Does that then help solidify, from a business standpoint, okay, we feel really good about this 60% for 2025 and '26, we'll work on these other 30%? Is that the kind of approach you're envisioning long term? George DeNardo: It definitely is. And it's the one thing I think every industry — this isn't just cannabis — the success we have is primarily driven by the people that work for the company. Those are our quality controls, those are the ones following our standard processes for top-quality product. Making sure every decision we make is good for the employees — a reduction of facilities is never easy, but making sure you give them enough runway. When they go to a different partner, there's that relationship of, you know, go work there, they're a great partner, they treat their people right, they're running a great company — and that's the reputation we're trying to build. Bryan Fields: Expanding on that — your growth in other facilities, like the one in Florida. Talk to us about the thought process of doubling down in Florida for cultivation. George DeNardo: A lot of people say double down, and I want to be honest with everyone, both internally and externally — we're filling a product category we haven't been able to fulfill, either from a brand perspective or a quality perspective, with indoor flower. This new Ocala facility — I'm very excited about it. I've been working the crop plans with the team, and I'm very excited about the genetics. Indoor flower is something we've never been able to really quantify — we have a modified greenhouse that grows quality product, but there's a difference in infrastructure. What this Ocala facility does is allow us to address that indoor, top-quality flower, but it also feeds into our derivative products, our oil — better input, better output. So I'm very excited about that. Bryan Fields: Is that an expanded approach — saying, we think Florida — still bullish for most of us that it's going to go adult-use eventually — and when that does happen, we want to have the resources and the horses ready to compete as a big growth driver for us? George DeNardo: So again, all my decisions are not based on any movement at the federal level, or expecting a politician to make the right decision for the industry — I'll use Virginia as an example. But again, it's allowing us to step into our brands, where we have Hayes, Kynd, and Later Days. Right now, our grow house in Gainesville does our Later Days-type flower. Out of Ocala, I can get that Kynd and Hayes flower, which is just a better-quality indoor product. Bryan Fields: Listen, it's the right approach not to bet on them to take the right approach, given the chaos we've seen. I guess naturally it's hard to plan strategically and estimate — okay, if this happens, well, we can't count on it happening. So you have to have plan A, B, and C just in case. George DeNardo: I am planning — I will get no benefit from the politicians, let's face it. If there is movement on the federal side, or even on a state side — Florida going adult-use, Pennsylvania going adult-use — that's all upside. I can have contingency plans for that, but I'd rather not bake the upside into the strategy, and plan to be the best company for who we are today, and then get the upside later on. Bryan Fields: Is there any fear that you might run out of supply — that if that upside hits really big, you don't have the manufacturing capabilities to meet that demand? George DeNardo: That's a good problem, I'll deal with that. In Florida, there's always that fear, because you sell what you make to the third-party wholesale market — like other states, once it's part of the medical program. Do they make that part of the adult-use program? Don't know. But to me, if I can sell everything I grow and make, that's a win. You see a lot of the price compression, folks with oversupply — that's a situation we're trying to avoid. Bryan Fields: Yeah, this is like part of the musical-chairs game of chaos — all the production increases, the price comes down, and now you're stuck with all this extra product. And sure, rationally, we could assume Florida should have passed adult use, but it didn't. Given that framework, you have to just put your head down and say, okay, we have to anticipate no changes coming forward, and if it does, and George wants that product — that's a good problem to have, and we'll be upset about it in the future, but that's one we're looking forward to being upset about. George DeNardo: Actually, I was reading about it — this was based on another interview — but in Florida, when they moved to the 60% threshold they needed to surpass, it was only approved at 56%. So how are we going to get to 60% when you only had 56%? You've got to sit there and just shake your head sometimes. Bryan Fields: You were talking earlier about having good, quality product — is that based on a North Star of saying, okay, our brands need to hit these certain metrics because we think brands will be part of the future, and to get there we need to start with a good-quality product? Is that how the decision-making works? George DeNardo: It really goes with the brand structure — I don't want to minimize the work we put into the brands in '24. We probably ran, I'd say, close to 20 devices through a number of exercises, all the way from quantifiable metrics to qualified feedback from our employees — how was the taste, how was the aroma, how was the pull. We took a statistical measurement and upgraded all the hardware for all of our vapes. Then we did a full look at our crop plan and said, okay, what have we been growing over the years that doesn't meet our financial metrics, and what can we bring in? Genetics have really evolved over the past three years, and in crop planning, we're making sure we're keeping our menus fresh — new strains, new varieties, hitting the many different demographics within the strain selection. Some people like fruity, some people like earthy — it really depends, and you have to make sure you're creating a brand portfolio with enough selection to address the majority of the demographics. Bryan Fields: Do you have to pre-allocate the whole crop to different brands — like each brand has a vape pen and an edible, and you're saying, hey, this crop, these yields go to these products? Is that a top-level thing that has to happen a year in advance? George DeNardo: It's a constant evolution. We do pheno hunts in pretty much every market, where you start with a few plants, look at the terpene levels, the potency, how it's looking. You also run it through a wash cycle to see how it washes, and an extraction cycle. Then you're really developing your crop plan to hit your brand strategy within your strain selection, but also within your product. I want strains that wash well and actually keep their flavor for all my rosin pens, or if I want to run it through a resin vape, I want high extraction rates. So yeah, we do crop planning on a monthly basis, but we have over 180 different genetics within our portfolio, and we're constantly adding to it, removing strains, adding strains, keeping it fresh. Bryan Fields: So how do you keep all that organized from a COGS standpoint — knowing that this is what your cultivation costs are for these strains, these brands, these products went into this strain, this one was going to go here but then you swapped — how do you keep your numbers clean so that when you hit the number out the door, you can feel confident that's what it actually cost you? George DeNardo: I'll give a huge shout-out to our chief technology officer, Sarvesh — he's done a phenomenal job establishing internal reporting, from crop planning to our lab extraction rates, where it's a simple click of a few toggles and we're finding that historical data. He's taken what I would call a complex Excel formula and put it into a simple, user-friendly interface that allows us to make very quick business decisions on how to move forward. Bryan Fields: That's so important, because just hearing you talk about the complexity of that — and that's one state — moving pieces, people changing ideas, saying this is a better match, we're going to go here — all of that has to be married together, because otherwise you're flying blind, and it's really difficult to know if you're hitting your margin structure. Without that, no idea. George DeNardo: And it's balancing our corporate goals with our financial goals and actually implementing it. When you look at everything that goes into that, it's complex — you need tools that create that integration. There are very few companies in cannabis that have an ERP system, being able to tie our different state systems together to give us a full readout of where we are on a daily or hourly basis. It took a lot of legwork by our IT team, but we're in a phenomenal position to really take advantage of that going forward. Bryan Fields: Did your IT team build that custom in-house, or was it pieced together from existing ERP solutions like SAP or something like that? George DeNardo: I'd say 80% in-house and then 20% pieced in. Bryan Fields: See, that's the insight I think people completely miss — given the framework of how complex all those elements are, if it's not structured so the data is flowing in on a regular basis, you're not able to make actionable decisions. And then again, you're flying completely blind, where it's just grow, grow, grow, grow, grow — but maybe these strains shouldn't be grown for extraction, and maybe these other strains should be doubled down on for extraction because they're yielding better than the others. George DeNardo: That's exactly it — when I joined in November 2023, it was really about establishing the standard process, having all the tools, gathering the data, and boiling down our brands to our three key brands. 2025 is all about implementation and sizing this company for who we are, and maximizing both the quality and the throughput with what we have in place. Not a lot of capex in 2025 — it's being smarter and much more clear on the direction we're headed in this year. Bryan Fields: A lot of that you can feel comfortable doing because you have those numbers rooted, so you know, okay, if we increase X here, we can expect this percentage jump. Without those numbers, maybe you increase your throughput, but maybe you're losing money on every product sold. George DeNardo: Before we made changes, we went down to every single piece of equipment — how many man-hours does it take to meet the S&OP? We've married aligning retail and operations together, our revenue-driving functions and our supply chain, and we're all singing from the same sheet of music — on a monthly basis, understanding what we need to provide, not only for our own stores but for developing relationships with all of our partners throughout our states. Making sure we're giving them the customer service, the product, and the quality their customers are looking for, and making sure we're reserving that space on the shelf for our brand. Bryan Fields: Yeah, it's well said, because it works beautifully in harmony, but it's so difficult to get everyone in the orchestra on the same page — because in the front of the house, when they're selling a certain product and the budtenders are hearing, hey, this product is killing it, we're loving this, what you want to do is continue that product up through the supply chain, because cannabis doesn't grow overnight. You need to reinvest back into the facility and allocate — okay, maybe next year we're going to put 20% of the facility toward this strain because this one's ripping through. George DeNardo: And that's the thing — a lot of people don't consider that everything comes from the crop. You make a decision, and it's 16 weeks before you see that benefit. It's not, okay, this week I want to do this, I want to sell this strain — that has to be thought of months beforehand. That's why we're constantly looking at what's coming out of our garden, how our supply is, what the sell-through is, not only at our own stores but other partnering stores, and making sure we're keeping pace with what our customers and our partner customers need. Bryan Fields: So each state is kind of managed as its own silo, with all that information coming in, because it's four walls? George DeNardo: Right. We have phenomenal leaders in wholesale, phenomenal leaders in retail — they're funneling that information to our chief revenue officers, Jamie and Julie, and we're working on a daily basis to make sure we're supporting our folks and making the right decisions, giving them the data they need to maximize efficiency. Bryan Fields: So the hierarchy allows the two of them to be really deep down in the operations, and then they can share that information with you, so strategically you all feel like you have enough pieces of information to understand what's going on. George DeNardo: Most definitely — and to be even more clear, Julie, Jamie, and myself, we're in our facilities all the time. It's not just looking at a spreadsheet and saying, okay, what's going on at this facility? We're physically walking through our gardens, physically walking through the customer experience at our stores, and walking through our partner stores saying, how can we better support you? So it's being involved with all of your folks. You could get caught up in all the data, but I also have a saying: sometimes there's too much data, and sometimes you just have to go in and see it. So all of us as leaders, from my facilities to the chief revenue officers, are all hands-on and engaged with our teams. And I'll go back to servant leadership — making sure we're serving them correctly and giving them the right information. Bryan Fields: How do you balance your time across all the different facilities? George DeNardo: I don't know — in a couple of weeks I'm going out to Nevada. Earlier we talked about East Coast, West Coast dedication — I have facilities in Nevada, I get on a flight, and I can get to all my East Coast facilities in a car while taking all my phone calls, then spend quality time with my teams. So it's a challenge. Luckily, COVID showed us all that you don't have to be there in person every day for the teams — a quick Teams call or Zoom call gives you that face-to-face interaction, which I think is extremely important, not only for our personnel but for our leaders, to make sure we're all engaged in the daily obstacles you're facing today and how we can help each other be successful. Bryan Fields: Are there any elements you think are underrated that your team is doing, that you think most people aren't aware of? George DeNardo: I will definitely say that IT has done a phenomenal job — I've had views into other operators, and I don't think they have the systems in place that we do, both from a retail perspective and an operational perspective. I have two leaders — Jamie Mandola and Julie Winter — whose knowledge within the industry, from startup to execution, is tremendous. I don't think everyone has that. You've seen the migration where a lot of companies have brought people in externally, wanting somebody from retail to do the work — but cannabis is built a little differently, it's a different culture, and sometimes that's not adaptable to what our customers are looking for. Having Jamie and Julie really drive that in-store experience, both in our walls and our partner walls — I'm not sure other operators can match that. Bryan Fields: I got to see Julie speak at the Benzinga Conference in New Jersey not too long ago, and I was impressed with the direction and strategic approach — understanding, here's where we think we can really attack the market, and here's where we're doubling down internally, organizationally, in order to approach that. Hats off to you for putting that team together. George DeNardo: It's the one thing I constantly stress — the leaders we have in this organization. When I joined, it was clearly evident we had quality leaders, and this year is all about really streamlining that, making sure we're all talking from the same page. I think so far it's been phenomenal. Bryan Fields: A lot of our listeners are builders and entrepreneurs looking to build into the space. Are there any areas or tools that your team is aware of, from a technology or challenge standpoint, that they could hear about and maybe build for the future? George DeNardo: I hate to frame this as a tool, but their voice — if they're new to the industry and trying to build something, they need to have communication with their regulators. There are so many people who say, okay, this is just retail, I'll get my building permits, I'll build out, and then I can open. Cannabis is built a little bit different — there are timelines and meetings, and having that communication and actually understanding the full picture of what they're stepping into, and the timing associated with it, is important. I see many people who say, I'm going to be open in three months, and they didn't plan accordingly, and they're sitting there at month ten, probably never going to open their door. So really getting out and talking to other industry personnel, and their regulators within the state they're looking to go into, is extremely important. I can't stress that enough. Bryan Fields: What is the book you gift the most? George DeNardo: I don't really gift books — I gift time. I go to my facilities, and having that face-to-face, to me — anyone can read a leadership book, and there are so many different philosophies on it. Anyone can read an operational book, a business development book — it's a ton of opinions. What's most important to the folks is knowing that you're engaged in the business, and that you're facing the battles they're facing every day with them, and being supportive. So the best gift, and this goes in my personal life too, the best gift anyone can ever give is the gift of time, because it's extremely important. Bryan Fields: Do you think it's more valuable to have a lunch or a dinner in terms of trying to create a bond with a new employee and gifting them that time? Where would you say is the most valuable place to do that? George DeNardo: Dinner, primarily because lunch is usually time-constrained — you're having to get back to work or calls. At dinner you can actually dedicate the time to the folks and establish — it's not only how can we take away their obstacles, but where do they want to be in three years, five years, ten years down the road, and how can we help them get there? My conversation with everyone is, I'm here to mentor and coach you and develop you, either to be successful with Ayr, and if that opportunity doesn't present itself at Ayr, to make sure you're successful with whoever you go work for after. It's making sure we're developing them as a person, so they'll be successful — and because we'll benefit from it too, in the end. Bryan Fields: What is the most expensive lesson you've ever learned? George DeNardo: I'm going to say — and this isn't with Ayr — the most expensive lesson is really hiring the wrong person. You lose a lot of time and money by not being overly selective, making sure that person is a good fit for what you're strategically trying to accomplish, and making sure you're treating them correctly once you select them — onboarding them in a quality way to be successful. I've had a couple of bad hires. It costs time, and it costs money. Bryan Fields: One year from now, we're sitting here — what has changed with Ayr? George DeNardo: I think we're going to be leaner. I think we're going to be stronger financially in our core markets. I think people are going to get us, and I think we're already seeing the tremendous growth within our brands. By implementing a few key strategic directions, I think we're going to see the growth of those brands come through in our markets. Bryan Fields: Last question — what question do you wish more people asked you? George DeNardo: That's a tough one, because I get asked questions every minute of the day. To be honest with you, I have a very open relationship — partners outside the industry, inside the industry, internally, externally. The one thing I'll say is, because this industry is so hard, there's a ton of collaboration. I'll give one example — Metrc created some issues with us, or Biotrack, within Florida, and the industry came together and we all talked: how are you guys handling this, how are you working through this situation? That collaboration — we're very open, and we ask a lot of questions of each other, because that's how industries grow up, making sure we're attacking it uniformly. Bryan Fields: I love it, that's great advice. So George, for our listeners who want to get in touch, want to learn more, and want to buy Ayr products, where can they find you? George DeNardo: We have operations in Massachusetts, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Florida, Nevada, Illinois, Connecticut, soon to be Virginia — we're planning our strategy there now. Kellen Finney: Ohio. George DeNardo: We're in multiple markets, and we're working on our wholesale, making sure we're on every shelf within the state so everyone has access. Bryan Fields: I love it, we'll link it in the show notes. Thanks for taking the time, this was a lot of fun. George DeNardo: No, thank you, I appreciate it.